Don Fitzgerald, Wow, I'm envisioning gazillions of invisible strings linking together many different spatial locations. But not everything is connected. Like the human brain, the connections follow certain patterns that have meaning. The connections might well occur following entanglement of sufficient strength. I presume we connect to a higher power or energy when we arouse high levels of entanglement. Could be one person, but more people focused on a single thought would be better. Makes me think of: "When two or more are gathered in my name," or "Ten men make a minyan," or "Chanting or singing among a group."
That “higher strength” is within all of us. Humans’ minds have been infected by an alien mind virus before Earth came into being.
Clif often talks about space beings. These entities are really called archons. They’ve been here “from the beginning.” They are liars and tricksters and walk among us. Our task is to “know” this and awaken to the truth about who we are and the power we have...as humans.
The aether was what was collected in the ancient architectural "Cathedrals" which was not built nor utilized as any place of worship initially. The floating / flying Vinmanas would recharge or be "gassed up" (for lack of a better phrase) from the antenna that peaked on the tops of those Aether collection structures. There are many renderings of this if you look for them. A Russian Historian and Archeologist has a Youtube channel called NewEarth, her best work is off Youtube because they kept censoring her. She once had an Advanced Truth Seeker series that took me almost a year to complete. WHEW!!!! is all I can say. If you find her Youtube channel, it will have a link to her private site. You could spend months there and still not finish reviewing all the evidence she has compiled of Tartaria, Star Forts, Mud Balls, Mounds, Orphan Trains, etc... its a cornucopia of fascinating and factual data as pertains to not only our past history, but the loss of between 400-600 years when we left the Julian calendar and began the Gregorian. I highly highly recommend her work.
I’m a previous yoga studio owner, highly trained yoga instructor who trains other instructors. You’re right on all accounts. Most never read Panjatali. Most that do, don’t go deeper into the Sutras. I have and I still learned from what you posted.
No body, huh? Then what, pray tell, is the medium for experiencing the "machine"? Or better said, what else is the body but the machine for experience?
I thought citta was well-summed up. With vrtti I think of the first line of the Odyssey, wherein Odysseus is called "polytropon", the many-turned man. What do all the examples, from Astronomy to Geometry have in common? They are indicators of an identity, a rupa. Just as Odysseus was well-turned in battle and encounter, so are the threads of world (guna) mixed and spun up into existence. By virtue of the vrtti we can get to know the identities behind OUR identification of them. Because right knowledge is itself a vrtti, this means that between the phenomenal manifestations is a world of energy-vortex-interaction to which we have no party. At best, we can reduce the ones inside, but even that can become a problem (yoga as samskara). Theoretically, the best state to see the world of vortex-energy swirling before our eye would be by removing the obstacles to do this--and these are indeed the very same vortex-energy which takes us away from witnessing the moment--cittavrtti.
Rudh means block, and ni- means to cease. Translating cittavrtti as "identity indicators", or "mind-application functors (indications of fuction or reward-suffering reaction-potential)" Yoga seems very much indeed like the art of finding peace by removing obstacles to the Self--parampurusha, Ishvara-inhabiting, very divine, very worthy upon reflection. If a religion is made that helps people attain this, if they use/misuse the word God, I see no reason to judge them based on the conviction that space alien technology could be involved.
So I would say 1.1: Yoga removes indicators of [mental]-activity [from the form of their aparition, citta] from blocking [that same metal apparatus from which they manifest, citta].
Let me therefore translate the sutras in this light:
1.Yoga removes the indicators of mental-activity from blocking,
2. and thereupon the seer sees the own form (which they were blocking),
3. otherwise the (svarupa's) forms take on the identity of the mental-activity of focus.
In other words: 2) because the experience of self necessitates liberation from attachment to the experience itself, 3) reference is made to the self-referential process (वृत्तिसारूप्यमितरत्र) in order to address the main concern: I become what I think and what I believe. 1) Yoga removes the need to think and the obsession with shared belief (apropos valid critiques of religious zealotry), allowing the existential experience (svarupavasthanam) to truly reflect that which I am.
"Rather this is explicitly referencing that aspect of the ‘vrtti’ which is the location as is defined as different from our current location by its distance in ‘time’." This accords with my experience, however distance in time I translate as परान्तर or proximity to touching, or reaching out (परिग्रह, ग्रहीतृग्रहणग्रह्यॆषु). While it's true that tada can be used temporally, that's not the case here. That would require a relative like Yada. Lacking that, I would say it refers to the matter sequentially: 1: yogashcittavrttinirodhaH--thereupon (tadaa)...so where is different? It is a comment on the existential nature of the svarupa state lacking vrttis besides those pure and whole to the functioning of the person--the minimum viable product if you will...and then there's all the crap we address by giving it attention. As Krishna said:
ज्ञानविज्ञानतृप्तात्मा कूटस्थो विजितेन्द्रिय: |
युक्त इत्युच्यते योगी समलोष्टाश्मकाञ्चन: || 8||
The yogi who are satisfied by knowledge and discrimination, and have conquered their senses, remain undisturbed in all circumstances. They see everything—dirt, stones, and gold—as the same.
I especially agree with:
"Citta, expresses a very sophisticated context of being the “last” of a series of mental (mind) states, that has a corresponding “body (brain)” state associated. It represents the totality of mental processes, including thoughts, emotions, perceptions, memories, and impressions. "Citta" is the subtle substance, or medium through which mental activities occur. Citta, can be thought of the long chain of processes involved in thought, but, is explicitly the final process as that is the one that determines the totality of the thought."
“Moved by time, the form of the seer/viewer/operator will abide in the seen location.”
I could be wrong, but this feels a little too "train station schedules for India!"--who told you time has anything to do with this, besides an AI? There are valid depths here to be probed for sure--but we should stick to the text and acknowledge that, as yet, nothing about time has been written--unless we assume that time happens sequentially. Would you care to reference a scholar of Sanskrit language? The threshold for misinformation is so low these days in these places! Where's the respect for the people who have been rewriting these texts generation after generation as the pages blur away--nope, my old-age hours with a chat bot are worth more of your time!
"When viewed from the vantage of a mind-to-machine interface, Patanjali’s Sutras on Union, are sensible, rational within their context, and need not be augmented or expanded."
"right out of the appropriate context of technology and into religion, but that is precisely the point here; that this has been done to Patanjali’s Yoga Sutras."
It's judgements like these which make me doubt that you have any Sanskrit speaking friends.
> mimic the ‘flow’ of information in technical manuals, which is not the same, nor even near, that of actual religious texts.
not for you, but a big portion of your worldview is about assuming things for other people and telling them to change their ways. A lot are great, and yet some really remind me of a younger self, and I'm still considered young! There is a web maxim I would like to bring to your attention, "beware a man alone in a room [for he will convince himself of anything and try to sell it to you as gospel.]" I sincerely hope that a lot of this is coms, and you do not give your faith anymore to this machine than you do to scholars.
All in all, I am glad you are discovering this work, Clif, but let me tell you it very much indeed has to do with breathing. I have almost passed out by following these instructions many a time--ironically, by avoiding organized religion and focusing on the science of spirituality, India produced these texts. To discount religion is a mistake, however--there may be secrets only worth telling to people who can get through Patanjali...
May I see with wonder the inner self these ancient texts help uncover.
There is no trigger warning for truth: it either hit you or it missed.
Likewise, there is no liability for falsehood: either the time's not right or the object-relation is wonky.
How do we KNOW? You may look to sources, which are cultural in origin. Religious scriptures from Ancient India are called Vedas, which means knowledge. There are several schools of interpretation, and benefits abount.
My question for you: how do we know when to apply knowledge, and how can we reach a state of abundance in which our hunger is satisfied?
My computer once got a virus that made it run completely crazy. In fact it bizarrely ran and ran and ran until it fried the hardware. That's how I feel about this material.
Thank you for this discussion of Clif's approach - both of which are beyond my ability to comment upon, although I too have had my non-standard considerations about 'yoga', and discoveries in relation to 'breath'.
However the connection with 'inter-dimensional technology' is tantalizing food for contemplation... How 'coincidental' is it that on the same day Clif posted this piece, my inbox produced an Italian article referring to work done at NASA about the similarity between Sanskrit and artificial machine language - a similarity said to be both in substance and in form.
Rick Briggs, Sanskrit and Artificial Intelligence, NASA Knowledge Representation in Sanskrit and Artificial Intelligence, AI Magazine vol 6, n 1, Spring 1985.
I feel like a teeny ant on this giant earth compared to the knowledge and depth of the unseen universes you discuss. And yet; if I do not think about the precise meaning of your written words, I get it! Thank you for the reparteé
Namaste everyone and thank you for your kind replies--I did not even translate the first sutra, अथयॊगानुशासानम्...So anu- is like the Greek "meta" and the German "nach"--it usually does indicate sequentiality--"new word now that we have the prefixed word".
If you were to mix the depth of the term "Cosmic Consciousness" with the trendiness of the keto diet, that many "Yoga" books existed back in India at all times. So I believe with the majority that Patanjali is providing an aid to people delving into a work like the Bhagavad Gita, where "yoga" comes forth practically every chapter!
Therefore I translate "anushasanam" as "meta-discipline," and the whole sutra as "Sincerest greetings, we now begin the meta-discipline of yoga."
My translations are not mutually exclusive with space aliens, but brings up an important consideration: beyond a certain point of technological, individual supremacy, things are supposed to get easier. So if we imagine a highly-advanced civilization, then we should not be surprised by the ergonomic comfort of their philosophy/machine operation instructions, nor by their ability to combine multiple uses into single texts. A common word to describe aliens is multidimensional, but in that case they would have a dimensional-overlap which binds them into manifestation. I therefore propose that all interpretations are valid, that the good ones will be those who do not exclude each other, and that the best ones are those which integrate the integral.
I'm not sure Clif is hung up on being "right" so much as "gee, I wanna know." He is a linguistics explorer - and he's willing to share. Right, wrong, etc., it's always interesting! (Personally, I trust his evaluations over damn near anybody else's.)
The only one who does "stretches" in our household is my kitten and he does not claim it is Yoga. Love this disclosure and I hope it will take the "smug" out of yoga for ever and the stretchy pants also.
As usual a very enlightening and entertaining episode of Aether Pirates of the Marrerium!
Yoga was practiced, taught by witnessing. It was not about authoring books, especially of such complexity. Nude, loin cloths or saris only. Smug wasn't a concept until the British arrived and they didn't sit in the dirt with the real people. Love your 'smug' and stretchy' words, but you forgot to mention 'latte'.
Love it! And "smug" is the exact word! HEHEHEHE Cats have their own --uh -- discipline, mostly involving "Boneless Meditation" and "Contemplation of the Food Bowl."
All this talk about "union" could be quantum entanglement, maybe? My bias is showing here, but humor me for a moment. The idea as expressed in my book "Conscious Matrix: Our Portal to God" is based on a very precise version of quantum mind theory. Stuart Hameroff took great pains to get his friends (Tuszynski, Craddock, among others) to find evidence of spatial patterns in hydrophobic pockets in the elongated microtubules that fill all living cells and play roles in cell division, but may play a critical role in learning and memory (my contribution based on immunohistochemical and biochemical studies done on rats trained on a fear conditioning paradigm in the early 1990's). In the book, I argue that humans grasp by pure intuition and introspection that our thoughts are cohesive. This cohesion could be because of quantum entanglements in roughly 20,000 neurons located both near and far that "entangle" free electrons in pockets of precisely located pockets, and this is a conscious thought held in a singular mind. It is a matrix--a 3-dimentional pattern--instantaneously joining electrons in perhaps a million spatiotemporal locations (short intervals of under 1 second). This spatiotemporal map that imprints on the brain due to the neuroplasticity "hardening" in these discreet sets could detect similar spatiotemporal maps floating in the invisible energy fields that surround us. In other words the idea of "ball," a concrete object, which is sphere that looks like a circle from all angles and can be played with, might be a concept floating in the energy fields that surround us, and when a child learns about such a toy, it's parameters match this free floating concept. Is such an idea possible? In neuropsychological terms every concept is created by either bottom-up (sensory point-to-point information) or top-down processing. But where do the top-down concepts come from??? If electron in hydrophobic pockets can entangle and assume linked dipoles and dipole changes, than why couldn't these same groups of entangled electrons link or couple with thoughts of others (as in social communication) or with "thought templates" free floating in energy fields. I know this sounds bizarre, but it is indeed plausible and it fits with seemingly unintelligible religious dogma from the present and from ancient times. And lastly, introducing space aliens only defers the solution to who, what, when, where and how was their consciousness created.
Funny how humans use intermediary languages such as English, math, Q & wave theory to communicate concepts that are so much more easily conveyed in thought / visuals... What do you think of Kozyrev's mirror?
Honestly I am just hungry for more knowledge about it. I think it has a connection to The Secret of the Golden Flower, which is how I got to experience non-linear time.
"Our minds are deeply entangled with the mind of God. Quantum mind theory shows us how that is possible. As newborn infants, we're equipped with the ability to connect to others, to learn language, and to create and invent all that we need to carry out our lives. There's good evidence that our soul is already connected to the soul of God, and that's what enables a readiness to do all that humankind is capable of doing. But just as our conscious matrix connects us to God before birth, we may remain connected to God for all eternity. These and other ideas are explored. " Source : https://www.powells.com/book/conscious-matrix-9781630508586
But ! What about the rest of the living plants, animals, - and the rest of it. Do you not think they are connected with our God ? Or is it just the living with a soul ?
Have not read your book, but that should be interesting.
Interesting point for which there are answers, all of which require belief in (or recognition of) certain paradigms. To avoid preconceived connotations, I tend to use Creator. For whatever the connection to that is, we are far, far down the food chain. Tesla was right, but I haven't really seen his concept taken far enough.
If we were to view the universe/ether/lifeforce/visible-and-invisible-existence accurately, in the Creator's reality, everything would be light/energy/vibration, like sparklers in a void (although I doubt it's a void, but more like a soup) or glowing bundles of energy - planets, galaxies, stars, souls, flowers, bees, whales, minerals - is there a limit to consciousness? How vast or finite does it have to be to not qualify? In this paradigm, all qualify. Sparkles. Glowing energy. (Sorry if this diverges from the discussion. That one paragraph got me thinking.)
With this view of existence, it's hard to get TOO bent out of shape about the foolish stupidities perpetrated on THIS plane, and yet deal with them we must or live miserably. It's interesting that Clif's commentaries cover so many topics and levels. (I wonder if, 300 yrs from now, "Clif's Commentaries" will be a published collection of wisdom! He'd find that hilarious, I'm sure.)
I wish you and I could have a talk. To describe the phenomena I experience with the Secret of the Golden Flower, and how I engage and harness light--letting it go like a butterfly.
The sensation of contemporaneous moments arrives displaced respective of the method of entry. I do not believe there are just top-down or just bottom-down, but I could be wrong. Anyway, my on-the-second challenge is remaining aware, attentive, and mindful of these energies.
They often want to compete, and so Yoga teaches nothing but balance and release. Yes, there is stretching, but what do I do after that?
When I lived on rural areas that show -cased Christian radio stations I remember the horrified voices of the moderators shrieking about the Satanic nature of yoga and cautioning listeners to run from the evil practitioners of this dark art. I used to chuckle at their fear of Asana practicing new agers,but now I wonder if there wasn't some old, dark
reason buried deep in psyche. A close friend of mine who makes beautiful jewelry and healing items from crystals was selling her wares recently at a gem. show and mentioned the energy of a particular stone to a customer. The shopper looked terrified and said I'm a Christian-- and we don't mess around with energy stuff and promptly scurried away Just the idea of exploring one's energy and learning to utilize it has been woven into all sorts of taboos and social no -nos, even to this day . Very interesting.
That is indeed funny, lol. I tend to think, the more I read, whether about science/religion/philosophy etc, that it is all reminiscent of the blind men and the elephant; where each of the blind men are holding a part of the elephant. Although each blind man can accurately describe his part of the elephant, he cannot see the whole picture and how everything is connected, and so does not understand how it can not only be like a tree trunk but also a fan, lol. It seems to me that this a great starting point for all of these disciplines and I greatly look forward to what future understandings we may learn from.
Ha reminds me. Of the Star Trek episode,where a religion was born from a burnt computer tech book after that’s world’s destruction, and was used by some to control the population
The Star Trek episode you are referring to is "A Piece of the Action," which is from the original Star Trek series (Season 2, Episode 17). In this episode, the USS Enterprise visits the planet Sigma Iotia II, which had been previously visited by a Federation starship a century earlier. However, the crew of that starship left behind a book on 20th-century Earth's gangster culture.
After the book was discovered by the inhabitants of Sigma Iotia II, they based their entire society and culture on the book's content, essentially creating a civilization modeled after Earth's 1920s gangster era. The episode explores the unintended consequences of leaving advanced technology and knowledge behind on a less-developed world and the resulting impact on their society.
Wow! This is fascinating as are all of your “teachings”. This one in particular will take multiple reads to digest. I’ll no doubt be reading it again and at least on my upcoming YOGA RETREAT in Greece💕. Namaste Uncle Clif.
"In the Kaliyuga it is difficult to have the feeling. " I am not the body, I am not the mind... I am beyond pleasure and pain. I am above disease and tried, old age and death'" (Gospel or Ramakrishna, 172.
How can one feel the true frequencies of a human being if they are cast into the a vortex of malfeasance with spiraling duality? As it gets larger with greater complexities, enhanced by increasing populations, educational, media, big Agra, pharma, market lies etc., everything is a choice on a string with two poles... It's pretty hard to envision then embrace stillness "I am not the body, I am not the mind' ....
Thank You Clif, Hello Humans Hello Humans
Nikola Tesla believed the aether to be real.
Tesla also insisted that Einstein was charlatan and his theories of energy and the universe to be mostly unprovable junk science
my opinion exactly. love Tesla, Einstein, not so much.
I always wondered how someone of Eistein's supposed brilliance could stand to work at such a mundane job.
I believe the aether is necessary for light and radio waves to travel, something akin to rail tracks if you will, or a road.
Don Fitzgerald, Wow, I'm envisioning gazillions of invisible strings linking together many different spatial locations. But not everything is connected. Like the human brain, the connections follow certain patterns that have meaning. The connections might well occur following entanglement of sufficient strength. I presume we connect to a higher power or energy when we arouse high levels of entanglement. Could be one person, but more people focused on a single thought would be better. Makes me think of: "When two or more are gathered in my name," or "Ten men make a minyan," or "Chanting or singing among a group."
That “higher strength” is within all of us. Humans’ minds have been infected by an alien mind virus before Earth came into being.
Clif often talks about space beings. These entities are really called archons. They’ve been here “from the beginning.” They are liars and tricksters and walk among us. Our task is to “know” this and awaken to the truth about who we are and the power we have...as humans.
It’s not unreasonable to speculate that Alby Onestones chatGP was the patent office’s body of data from which he spun his web of deception
The aether was what was collected in the ancient architectural "Cathedrals" which was not built nor utilized as any place of worship initially. The floating / flying Vinmanas would recharge or be "gassed up" (for lack of a better phrase) from the antenna that peaked on the tops of those Aether collection structures. There are many renderings of this if you look for them. A Russian Historian and Archeologist has a Youtube channel called NewEarth, her best work is off Youtube because they kept censoring her. She once had an Advanced Truth Seeker series that took me almost a year to complete. WHEW!!!! is all I can say. If you find her Youtube channel, it will have a link to her private site. You could spend months there and still not finish reviewing all the evidence she has compiled of Tartaria, Star Forts, Mud Balls, Mounds, Orphan Trains, etc... its a cornucopia of fascinating and factual data as pertains to not only our past history, but the loss of between 400-600 years when we left the Julian calendar and began the Gregorian. I highly highly recommend her work.
I’m a previous yoga studio owner, highly trained yoga instructor who trains other instructors. You’re right on all accounts. Most never read Panjatali. Most that do, don’t go deeper into the Sutras. I have and I still learned from what you posted.
That’s settled it! I am pimping my yoga mat into a flying carpet😂
It's the Levitiathan!
Dear Shannon,
"you're right on all accounts" is happily wrong, however Clif usually gets somethings right. Some corrections off the bat:
No breathwork: shvasaprashvasa तस्मिन्सति श्वासप्रश्वासयोर्गतिविच्छेदः प्राणायामः॥४९॥
Tasminsati śvāsapraśvāsayorgativicchedaḥ prāṇāyāmaḥ||49||
No God: Ishvara (see https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GlcEBZuA-Xw&t=1743s&pp=ygUPc2hpdm8gaGFtIHJ1ZHJh). ईश्वरप्रणिधानाद्वा॥२३॥
Īśvarapraṇidhānādvā||23||क्लेशकर्मविपाकाशयैरपरामृष्टः पुरुषविशेष ईश्वरः॥२४॥
Kleśakarmavipākāśayairaparāmṛṣṭaḥ puruṣaviśeṣa īśvaraḥ||24||
From here on out, I will address Clif directly.
No body, huh? Then what, pray tell, is the medium for experiencing the "machine"? Or better said, what else is the body but the machine for experience?
I thought citta was well-summed up. With vrtti I think of the first line of the Odyssey, wherein Odysseus is called "polytropon", the many-turned man. What do all the examples, from Astronomy to Geometry have in common? They are indicators of an identity, a rupa. Just as Odysseus was well-turned in battle and encounter, so are the threads of world (guna) mixed and spun up into existence. By virtue of the vrtti we can get to know the identities behind OUR identification of them. Because right knowledge is itself a vrtti, this means that between the phenomenal manifestations is a world of energy-vortex-interaction to which we have no party. At best, we can reduce the ones inside, but even that can become a problem (yoga as samskara). Theoretically, the best state to see the world of vortex-energy swirling before our eye would be by removing the obstacles to do this--and these are indeed the very same vortex-energy which takes us away from witnessing the moment--cittavrtti.
Rudh means block, and ni- means to cease. Translating cittavrtti as "identity indicators", or "mind-application functors (indications of fuction or reward-suffering reaction-potential)" Yoga seems very much indeed like the art of finding peace by removing obstacles to the Self--parampurusha, Ishvara-inhabiting, very divine, very worthy upon reflection. If a religion is made that helps people attain this, if they use/misuse the word God, I see no reason to judge them based on the conviction that space alien technology could be involved.
So I would say 1.1: Yoga removes indicators of [mental]-activity [from the form of their aparition, citta] from blocking [that same metal apparatus from which they manifest, citta].
Let me therefore translate the sutras in this light:
1.Yoga removes the indicators of mental-activity from blocking,
2. and thereupon the seer sees the own form (which they were blocking),
3. otherwise the (svarupa's) forms take on the identity of the mental-activity of focus.
In other words: 2) because the experience of self necessitates liberation from attachment to the experience itself, 3) reference is made to the self-referential process (वृत्तिसारूप्यमितरत्र) in order to address the main concern: I become what I think and what I believe. 1) Yoga removes the need to think and the obsession with shared belief (apropos valid critiques of religious zealotry), allowing the existential experience (svarupavasthanam) to truly reflect that which I am.
"Rather this is explicitly referencing that aspect of the ‘vrtti’ which is the location as is defined as different from our current location by its distance in ‘time’." This accords with my experience, however distance in time I translate as परान्तर or proximity to touching, or reaching out (परिग्रह, ग्रहीतृग्रहणग्रह्यॆषु). While it's true that tada can be used temporally, that's not the case here. That would require a relative like Yada. Lacking that, I would say it refers to the matter sequentially: 1: yogashcittavrttinirodhaH--thereupon (tadaa)...so where is different? It is a comment on the existential nature of the svarupa state lacking vrttis besides those pure and whole to the functioning of the person--the minimum viable product if you will...and then there's all the crap we address by giving it attention. As Krishna said:
ज्ञानविज्ञानतृप्तात्मा कूटस्थो विजितेन्द्रिय: |
युक्त इत्युच्यते योगी समलोष्टाश्मकाञ्चन: || 8||
The yogi who are satisfied by knowledge and discrimination, and have conquered their senses, remain undisturbed in all circumstances. They see everything—dirt, stones, and gold—as the same.
I especially agree with:
"Citta, expresses a very sophisticated context of being the “last” of a series of mental (mind) states, that has a corresponding “body (brain)” state associated. It represents the totality of mental processes, including thoughts, emotions, perceptions, memories, and impressions. "Citta" is the subtle substance, or medium through which mental activities occur. Citta, can be thought of the long chain of processes involved in thought, but, is explicitly the final process as that is the one that determines the totality of the thought."
“Moved by time, the form of the seer/viewer/operator will abide in the seen location.”
I could be wrong, but this feels a little too "train station schedules for India!"--who told you time has anything to do with this, besides an AI? There are valid depths here to be probed for sure--but we should stick to the text and acknowledge that, as yet, nothing about time has been written--unless we assume that time happens sequentially. Would you care to reference a scholar of Sanskrit language? The threshold for misinformation is so low these days in these places! Where's the respect for the people who have been rewriting these texts generation after generation as the pages blur away--nope, my old-age hours with a chat bot are worth more of your time!
"When viewed from the vantage of a mind-to-machine interface, Patanjali’s Sutras on Union, are sensible, rational within their context, and need not be augmented or expanded."
"right out of the appropriate context of technology and into religion, but that is precisely the point here; that this has been done to Patanjali’s Yoga Sutras."
It's judgements like these which make me doubt that you have any Sanskrit speaking friends.
> mimic the ‘flow’ of information in technical manuals, which is not the same, nor even near, that of actual religious texts.
not for you, but a big portion of your worldview is about assuming things for other people and telling them to change their ways. A lot are great, and yet some really remind me of a younger self, and I'm still considered young! There is a web maxim I would like to bring to your attention, "beware a man alone in a room [for he will convince himself of anything and try to sell it to you as gospel.]" I sincerely hope that a lot of this is coms, and you do not give your faith anymore to this machine than you do to scholars.
All in all, I am glad you are discovering this work, Clif, but let me tell you it very much indeed has to do with breathing. I have almost passed out by following these instructions many a time--ironically, by avoiding organized religion and focusing on the science of spirituality, India produced these texts. To discount religion is a mistake, however--there may be secrets only worth telling to people who can get through Patanjali...
May I see with wonder the inner self these ancient texts help uncover.
Om namah Shivaya.
With all due respect to those who have studied this topic . . . How do we KNOW anything while we have been lied to for millennia?
It’s all quite fascinating to take in these interpretations, however, I do better to trust my intuition . . .
Namaste 🙏🏼
Suze
Be careful...Clif will be after that next...
There is no trigger warning for truth: it either hit you or it missed.
Likewise, there is no liability for falsehood: either the time's not right or the object-relation is wonky.
How do we KNOW? You may look to sources, which are cultural in origin. Religious scriptures from Ancient India are called Vedas, which means knowledge. There are several schools of interpretation, and benefits abount.
My question for you: how do we know when to apply knowledge, and how can we reach a state of abundance in which our hunger is satisfied?
I find it enormously beneficial to cut through the gordian knot and approach these writings with a bit of levity
My computer once got a virus that made it run completely crazy. In fact it bizarrely ran and ran and ran until it fried the hardware. That's how I feel about this material.
Could not agree more! How anyone survives without a sense of humour is beyond my ken...
Yogi-ji,
Thank you for this discussion of Clif's approach - both of which are beyond my ability to comment upon, although I too have had my non-standard considerations about 'yoga', and discoveries in relation to 'breath'.
However the connection with 'inter-dimensional technology' is tantalizing food for contemplation... How 'coincidental' is it that on the same day Clif posted this piece, my inbox produced an Italian article referring to work done at NASA about the similarity between Sanskrit and artificial machine language - a similarity said to be both in substance and in form.
https://onebooks.it/sanscrito-la-lingua-perfetta-che-assomiglia-a-un-linguaggio-macchina/
referring to:
Rick Briggs, Sanskrit and Artificial Intelligence, NASA Knowledge Representation in Sanskrit and Artificial Intelligence, AI Magazine vol 6, n 1, Spring 1985.
Ji Mati!
LOL you get mye, which is letter "e" pronounced backwards. or "me"
No blinks, no repeats--starting with the setting sun: Dhrtrashtra.
Please enjoy the Sanskritam.
I feel like a teeny ant on this giant earth compared to the knowledge and depth of the unseen universes you discuss. And yet; if I do not think about the precise meaning of your written words, I get it! Thank you for the reparteé
My stomach grumbles in jealousy at the full and flowing power of your non-doing.
Namaste everyone and thank you for your kind replies--I did not even translate the first sutra, अथयॊगानुशासानम्...So anu- is like the Greek "meta" and the German "nach"--it usually does indicate sequentiality--"new word now that we have the prefixed word".
If you were to mix the depth of the term "Cosmic Consciousness" with the trendiness of the keto diet, that many "Yoga" books existed back in India at all times. So I believe with the majority that Patanjali is providing an aid to people delving into a work like the Bhagavad Gita, where "yoga" comes forth practically every chapter!
Therefore I translate "anushasanam" as "meta-discipline," and the whole sutra as "Sincerest greetings, we now begin the meta-discipline of yoga."
My translations are not mutually exclusive with space aliens, but brings up an important consideration: beyond a certain point of technological, individual supremacy, things are supposed to get easier. So if we imagine a highly-advanced civilization, then we should not be surprised by the ergonomic comfort of their philosophy/machine operation instructions, nor by their ability to combine multiple uses into single texts. A common word to describe aliens is multidimensional, but in that case they would have a dimensional-overlap which binds them into manifestation. I therefore propose that all interpretations are valid, that the good ones will be those who do not exclude each other, and that the best ones are those which integrate the integral.
You’re right! He’s not “absolutely” right. But he’s still right for the most part.
I'm not sure Clif is hung up on being "right" so much as "gee, I wanna know." He is a linguistics explorer - and he's willing to share. Right, wrong, etc., it's always interesting! (Personally, I trust his evaluations over damn near anybody else's.)
The only one who does "stretches" in our household is my kitten and he does not claim it is Yoga. Love this disclosure and I hope it will take the "smug" out of yoga for ever and the stretchy pants also.
As usual a very enlightening and entertaining episode of Aether Pirates of the Marrerium!
Yoga was practiced, taught by witnessing. It was not about authoring books, especially of such complexity. Nude, loin cloths or saris only. Smug wasn't a concept until the British arrived and they didn't sit in the dirt with the real people. Love your 'smug' and stretchy' words, but you forgot to mention 'latte'.
Love it! And "smug" is the exact word! HEHEHEHE Cats have their own --uh -- discipline, mostly involving "Boneless Meditation" and "Contemplation of the Food Bowl."
Perhaps the dog pose wuddn’t be appropriate for the cat who sat on the mat?
That is Phelix's favorite pose!
All this talk about "union" could be quantum entanglement, maybe? My bias is showing here, but humor me for a moment. The idea as expressed in my book "Conscious Matrix: Our Portal to God" is based on a very precise version of quantum mind theory. Stuart Hameroff took great pains to get his friends (Tuszynski, Craddock, among others) to find evidence of spatial patterns in hydrophobic pockets in the elongated microtubules that fill all living cells and play roles in cell division, but may play a critical role in learning and memory (my contribution based on immunohistochemical and biochemical studies done on rats trained on a fear conditioning paradigm in the early 1990's). In the book, I argue that humans grasp by pure intuition and introspection that our thoughts are cohesive. This cohesion could be because of quantum entanglements in roughly 20,000 neurons located both near and far that "entangle" free electrons in pockets of precisely located pockets, and this is a conscious thought held in a singular mind. It is a matrix--a 3-dimentional pattern--instantaneously joining electrons in perhaps a million spatiotemporal locations (short intervals of under 1 second). This spatiotemporal map that imprints on the brain due to the neuroplasticity "hardening" in these discreet sets could detect similar spatiotemporal maps floating in the invisible energy fields that surround us. In other words the idea of "ball," a concrete object, which is sphere that looks like a circle from all angles and can be played with, might be a concept floating in the energy fields that surround us, and when a child learns about such a toy, it's parameters match this free floating concept. Is such an idea possible? In neuropsychological terms every concept is created by either bottom-up (sensory point-to-point information) or top-down processing. But where do the top-down concepts come from??? If electron in hydrophobic pockets can entangle and assume linked dipoles and dipole changes, than why couldn't these same groups of entangled electrons link or couple with thoughts of others (as in social communication) or with "thought templates" free floating in energy fields. I know this sounds bizarre, but it is indeed plausible and it fits with seemingly unintelligible religious dogma from the present and from ancient times. And lastly, introducing space aliens only defers the solution to who, what, when, where and how was their consciousness created.
Funny how humans use intermediary languages such as English, math, Q & wave theory to communicate concepts that are so much more easily conveyed in thought / visuals... What do you think of Kozyrev's mirror?
Honestly I am just hungry for more knowledge about it. I think it has a connection to The Secret of the Golden Flower, which is how I got to experience non-linear time.
Reminds me about Orgone : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orgone
Learning about it now. Thank you for bringing it up.
"Our minds are deeply entangled with the mind of God. Quantum mind theory shows us how that is possible. As newborn infants, we're equipped with the ability to connect to others, to learn language, and to create and invent all that we need to carry out our lives. There's good evidence that our soul is already connected to the soul of God, and that's what enables a readiness to do all that humankind is capable of doing. But just as our conscious matrix connects us to God before birth, we may remain connected to God for all eternity. These and other ideas are explored. " Source : https://www.powells.com/book/conscious-matrix-9781630508586
But ! What about the rest of the living plants, animals, - and the rest of it. Do you not think they are connected with our God ? Or is it just the living with a soul ?
Have not read your book, but that should be interesting.
Good questions! I had to limit my writing to those topics with which I'm familiar.
Interesting point for which there are answers, all of which require belief in (or recognition of) certain paradigms. To avoid preconceived connotations, I tend to use Creator. For whatever the connection to that is, we are far, far down the food chain. Tesla was right, but I haven't really seen his concept taken far enough.
If we were to view the universe/ether/lifeforce/visible-and-invisible-existence accurately, in the Creator's reality, everything would be light/energy/vibration, like sparklers in a void (although I doubt it's a void, but more like a soup) or glowing bundles of energy - planets, galaxies, stars, souls, flowers, bees, whales, minerals - is there a limit to consciousness? How vast or finite does it have to be to not qualify? In this paradigm, all qualify. Sparkles. Glowing energy. (Sorry if this diverges from the discussion. That one paragraph got me thinking.)
With this view of existence, it's hard to get TOO bent out of shape about the foolish stupidities perpetrated on THIS plane, and yet deal with them we must or live miserably. It's interesting that Clif's commentaries cover so many topics and levels. (I wonder if, 300 yrs from now, "Clif's Commentaries" will be a published collection of wisdom! He'd find that hilarious, I'm sure.)
I have a concept, that is easier to understand - the sun.
Without it, noting we see living on our planet would be alive.
So all the living organisms are connected to the sun.
Is the sun our God ?
I wish you and I could have a talk. To describe the phenomena I experience with the Secret of the Golden Flower, and how I engage and harness light--letting it go like a butterfly.
The sensation of contemporaneous moments arrives displaced respective of the method of entry. I do not believe there are just top-down or just bottom-down, but I could be wrong. Anyway, my on-the-second challenge is remaining aware, attentive, and mindful of these energies.
They often want to compete, and so Yoga teaches nothing but balance and release. Yes, there is stretching, but what do I do after that?
Om Jaya Kritamudram Astika!
When I lived on rural areas that show -cased Christian radio stations I remember the horrified voices of the moderators shrieking about the Satanic nature of yoga and cautioning listeners to run from the evil practitioners of this dark art. I used to chuckle at their fear of Asana practicing new agers,but now I wonder if there wasn't some old, dark
reason buried deep in psyche. A close friend of mine who makes beautiful jewelry and healing items from crystals was selling her wares recently at a gem. show and mentioned the energy of a particular stone to a customer. The shopper looked terrified and said I'm a Christian-- and we don't mess around with energy stuff and promptly scurried away Just the idea of exploring one's energy and learning to utilize it has been woven into all sorts of taboos and social no -nos, even to this day . Very interesting.
That is indeed funny, lol. I tend to think, the more I read, whether about science/religion/philosophy etc, that it is all reminiscent of the blind men and the elephant; where each of the blind men are holding a part of the elephant. Although each blind man can accurately describe his part of the elephant, he cannot see the whole picture and how everything is connected, and so does not understand how it can not only be like a tree trunk but also a fan, lol. It seems to me that this a great starting point for all of these disciplines and I greatly look forward to what future understandings we may learn from.
In a sense, I am mind blown Clif, your insight and level of productivity is beyond my current state.
Thank you though. the expansion of mind is always much in need.
Blessings my friend.
Thank You, For All The Work clif !
10-4 , I second that emotion ! Thank you Clif , and these comment sections are totally bona fide !
The military has probably been paying people for decades to figure this out, and here you are doing it in your spare time. Love it.
I don't think the military is that smart.
Monkey Mind... easy earth stuff.
Citta Mind ... dynamic, complete, holy, infinite focus. (Yes?)
Heck yes, we need a “manual and a “womanual for that.
Fastening the seatbelt!
Ha reminds me. Of the Star Trek episode,where a religion was born from a burnt computer tech book after that’s world’s destruction, and was used by some to control the population
The Star Trek episode you are referring to is "A Piece of the Action," which is from the original Star Trek series (Season 2, Episode 17). In this episode, the USS Enterprise visits the planet Sigma Iotia II, which had been previously visited by a Federation starship a century earlier. However, the crew of that starship left behind a book on 20th-century Earth's gangster culture.
After the book was discovered by the inhabitants of Sigma Iotia II, they based their entire society and culture on the book's content, essentially creating a civilization modeled after Earth's 1920s gangster era. The episode explores the unintended consequences of leaving advanced technology and knowledge behind on a less-developed world and the resulting impact on their society.
Wow! This is fascinating as are all of your “teachings”. This one in particular will take multiple reads to digest. I’ll no doubt be reading it again and at least on my upcoming YOGA RETREAT in Greece💕. Namaste Uncle Clif.
Quite an interesting viewpoint! I, too, have been a 50+ year student. I look forward to rereading my copy with wider eyes!
Fascinating. Really appreciate all your time in breaking it down.
"In the Kaliyuga it is difficult to have the feeling. " I am not the body, I am not the mind... I am beyond pleasure and pain. I am above disease and tried, old age and death'" (Gospel or Ramakrishna, 172.
How can one feel the true frequencies of a human being if they are cast into the a vortex of malfeasance with spiraling duality? As it gets larger with greater complexities, enhanced by increasing populations, educational, media, big Agra, pharma, market lies etc., everything is a choice on a string with two poles... It's pretty hard to envision then embrace stillness "I am not the body, I am not the mind' ....
What is the wave pattern of infinity?
Timing is everything. Thanks Clif. Shit won’t stop getting interesting !
Finally. It makes a lot sense considering precision polygonal stuff and giza.