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Paddy O'Furniture's avatar

Yeah Thinking and Destiny is a tough read, but even after one pass I grokked the essence, I guess that would be my knower's doing. After many re-reads all the unfamiliar words and constructs fell more into place so it is def worth the time and effort. it's the nuts and bolts, with excruciating detail, of reincarnation and of our true selves as immortal souls/energies/frequencies, a fractal of the Supreme Consciousness

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Andy Akey's avatar

Paddy, I'm around page 700 of Thinking and Destiny. Yes, tough read! Took me the first 100 pages to get into the author's mindset. Thank God he repeats his dissertations, giving my brain a second chance to digest. I wondered about half way through as to how he knows, and he answered my concern. Knowers are present through doers and your triune self. Triune is brilliant, tri is three in une, one. I recommend anyone tackling this great reveal to first read/review the back of the book to see the illustrations and definitions (back 20 or so pages). I will re read, it's that detailed and good. By the way, karma is a bitch, inescapable and truly earned. Pay now or pay the next time. Love it. And we are in the 4th iteration of humanity attempting to climb the hill to a balanced construct of ourselves. Thank you Harold Percival.

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Suzette Maraid's avatar

Thank you for this. I’m a few pages in. Hopefully your advice will make it easier. Lol, is that possible?

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Voice Of The Doer's avatar

Hi Suzette! I had a hard time the first time through. I made a workbook to help me understand. Maybe it could be helpful for you too? Let me know if i can add anything to make it more clear. Thinking anf Destiny has literaly changed my life. Thanks! https://voiceofthedoer.gumroad.com/l/jjiloo

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TiredOfTheBull's avatar

Thank you for your efforts! Downloaded.

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Voice Of The Doer's avatar

Please let me know if I can change or add anything. Thank you for checking it out!!

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Te Burt's avatar

Thank you for the link. I got 10 pages in and stopped. (I printed out the PDF.) Now that I know the gist of it, I am more interested and more motivated to start again. It may take me years as I have a tendency to stop and consider. Picked up your "workbook" and saved it for future reference.

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Voice Of The Doer's avatar

Thanks, Burt. I'm 5 years or so into owning and on my third read now and, honestly, when I first started was like, what the heck, but now some of the insights that just hit me from my own life and qualia, it's mind blowing. For example, a day in hte life is the same as a life. After thinking about it, it's true. We get to make decisions everyday and those decisions produce outcomes. it's those lifetime of daily decisions that make up the life. Change the daily decisions, change the life. It still gets me. If I can add, clarify, or update anything, please let me know. Thank you!

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Te Burt's avatar

Very kind! Thanks! Love the connections I make here to other thinking people as I live in an area where there's literally nobody to discuss anything that isn't related to Christianity. Good friends and good people, but don't meet any who are interested in these subjects.

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Andy Akey's avatar

Suzette, it gets easier as you progress into the book. Stay with it, well worth it.

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John Galt's avatar

Is it Tara with a hard 'a' or Tara with a soft 'a'? I always get that wrong. In any case you're spam.

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Marcos's avatar

just bought it!! lol, yea i was going to send Cliff gratitude, i'm seeing so many patterns in my life that resonate with exactly what he shares, i have not experienced out of body but just overall the seperation from the individual and personal realms of the 7 planes of man makes perfect sense to be.. this is remarkable.

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JustAsIthought's avatar

I found it much easier to understand in the audio version - avail free on the publisher's site, same place you download the book. Read by a very professional voice.

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Vee McCoy's avatar

So how did Percival uncover his knowledge?

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peter's avatar

this is truly the most important question to ask. perhaps knowing how he obtained the amount of detail would be detrimental because it was in a way that is itself not believable. nevertheless, i find the book extremely difficult to read, due to the archaic english used and also because of author's inability to present the material in a logical fashion, inventing new terminology without explanation. i started reading it several times and i stopped all frustrated every time. i can read and understand the most advanced technical literature, but this may be beyond my ability.

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Voice Of The Doer's avatar

Same here Peter. I muscled my way through the first time. It truly taken more somewhere around 5 years to digest and begin to understand. I created this workbook to help me through the terminology. I'm slowing adding in all the books Clif has recommended over the years. Here is a link to the guide. It doesn't cost anything but I hope it helps you like it has me. I am in awe of what I am learning about myself through the lens of this book. Though I can't say I agree with everything, it's nonetheless made me consider my thinking and what I allow to dominate. My life has changed in so many ways and continues to. But as Clif says, I could try to explain it but no one else woudl really get it because it's only for me. I wish you luck and hope you can muscle through for the reward of hearing the Voice of Your Doer!! https://voiceofthedoer.gumroad.com/l/jjiloo If you find anything confusing or have a recommendation, please let me know how I can make this tool even more useful for us all.

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JustAsIthought's avatar

I find the audio version much easier to follow. It's available on the publisher's site free.

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Voice Of The Doer's avatar

I had a hard time reading it through, I kept stopping to look words up to try to understand. Then it just hit me, I should listen to the book all the way through and not stop to look anything up. I'm glad I did that because the reality is all the information is new. At least listening through gave me a superficial understanding. When I listened again and then paired that up with reading it, I was really able to retain the topics. for example, I was taking a bath when it occurred to me that I was literally sitting in the radiant and fluid spheres. Little things like that are happening all the time to help reinforce the ideas. The guide I put together provides the pages numbers for the online book as well as a link to the audio book. Does your browser remember where you left off in hte audio book? Mine doesn't and sometimes I cannot remember which chapter I stopped at. Though that doesn't really matter because I just pick another and it's always interstesting. Thank you and luck listening to T&D! Here is the link to the guide I created. It's totally free. I hope it helps! https://voiceofthedoer.gumroad.com/l/jjiloo

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Peggy Gilmour's avatar

I ordered it, will get it next month. It should remind me of reading "Gone with the Wind" one summer when I was in Grade school.

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Catie's avatar

From the Theosophical Society from which he was the president in New York for many years.

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Marcos's avatar

That's a good question, now is to dig deeper on the authors bio, just finding a good source that is authentic of his bio is the tough part unless some assistance from Ai may help. i haven't used Ai but i know others who have lol , i may ask them to research for me , not sure.

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Monet's avatar

Thank you...all I could get initially is the essence of the idea of the triune self and the longing and desire to not be separated. That burned as absolute truth so I kept reading...but yes it's dense and challenging and I only have impressions and knowing I can't explain. The book is a fixture on my nightstand...waiting for me to dive back in ☺️. And if course here I am as Cliff brought it up again....

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Roxy Ballard's avatar

Good on ya, mate!

The only thing that I remember now about Thinking and Destiny is that is was, as you say, a “tough read”! And literally heavy to hold. 😉 I may have even finished it - not sure? (Bought it at the Theosophical Society Book Store in Melbourne c. 1971-72.) Somehow I’ve gathered the gist from countless other paperbacks over the years and living out the karma. My knower has been generous with plenty of qualia along the way. I’m grateful for my “interesting” life!

Cheers Everyone!

🌈R

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Erik van Mechelen's avatar

'my knower has been generous...' -> a lovely thought, perhaps knower will send more qualia with understanding there is a doer listening and attending to qualia

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Sandra Crede's avatar

Reading and re-reading and have deemed it my bible. Resonates so deeply especially regarding early life experiences… That innocent undisrupted intuitive sense of knowing through communication with the self- knower.

However… that said…Along with the knowing that we’ll also never know everything… to allow the possibility that the thinker (or stupid human brain aspect of self LOL) can also come to conclusions to confuse what the knowing-self knows and/or… that we don’t yet know what we think and/or or perceived as being our knowing self… Which is also why and when Shit happen!🤣

Not sure if I made this make sense?? Nonetheless… sometimes - if not no time- (pun)) language just doesn’t suffice when it comes to woo conversation. Best we can do is nod to one another 🤔 🫡 ☝️

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Sandra Crede's avatar

PS- Been a prolific reader, of so many books about life’s meaning, humanity, sociology, astrology etc…since left school at age 16. To pursue self education re: life purpose. Perceivable is a tough read… because its (IMPO & experience) the closest I’ve ever felt to the truth and thus can be understood (even when I might not immediately think I’m understanding) as it ties into experiences one might be unable to base on what we experience as logic in human aspects of our existence her in this asylum LOl!

I Love to read a chapter or 2 of Percival’s T&D then close the book and re-open to any random page… fun to see what comes up… Often feels sort of a “qualia” that something more just “clicks in” so to speak Experience. 🤔

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GranniHillWilli's avatar

I call that "Book Tarot" and it's the reason I can't release books out of my library. A "random" look into a book always reveals something I can use in my day. Today I read "Art is the conversation between lovers. True art awakes the Extraordinary Ovation." ~ Hafiz

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Erik van Mechelen's avatar

thank you for describing with 'book tarot' what i do much of the time :)

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Sandra Crede's avatar

“Book Tarot” Love that!

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Peggy Gilmour's avatar

If that happened, that would be novelty. Asimov: "Make God laugh - tell him your plans."

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Te Burt's avatar

Good one! LOL I have to make a poster of that one!

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Te Burt's avatar

It becomes a sort of Tower of Babel, battling our lower self limitations with language. Perhaps the fact that I am a writer will help; good grounding in language, inferences, how to progress a theme, can help. I quit after 10 pages, mostly because I did not know the point of it. Now I do, and this topic is a life-long fascination.

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Santo Cav's avatar

Made a wiki of T & D many many years ago for this very purpose... ease of querying and reading...

https://destiny.wikidot.com/

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Voice Of The Doer's avatar

Nice work. I wish I would have known about your wiki about five years ago. Thank you for putting in all that work and sharing it.

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Mary's avatar

I got crazy busy with my business in the last 2 months, but I am about half way through it. I agree, it is worth the effort.

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Voice Of The Doer's avatar

Hi Paddy, I hear you about Thinking and Destiny. I made a workbook to help me through the material. On my 3rd read of it. Maybe you'd find it of value? Let me know what I can add or change. I started Voice of the Doer because of Clif after he's said numerous times someone should start a course. This is the start, mostly to help me but I hope it can also help others. Thanks!! https://voiceofthedoer.gumroad.com/l/jjiloo

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Paddy O'Furniture's avatar

Anyone starting out will REALLY find it valuable. If finding Clif for only this one reason, he introduced T&D to his readership some 3-4 yrs ago if I'm estimating accurately, it would have been worth it but he introduces so much more and in so many different fields. A true Renaissance man for the times, I'm just happy to ride his coattails and thus multiply my daily qualia sevenfold.

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Voice Of The Doer's avatar

I agree. I’ve been following since 2012ish. I’ve changed my life in too many ways to count ways because of the information he has shared over the years. And best of all, I love that he’s cantankerous about it. I love that he does not care if you like him, love him, hate him, he’s just sharing. It’s rare to find people who are willing to be authentic, no matter what. We’re lucky that the Creator is sharing Clif High with us!

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John Galt's avatar

I am working out of a trailer in the woods, building roads. It's raining. I have a tenor saxophone I'm learning to play and my virgin copy of Thinking and Destiny.

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Paddy O'Furniture's avatar

"I'll learn to work the saxophone, I, I'll play just what I feel,

drink scotch whiskey all night long, and die behind the wheel"

they have a name for winners in the world, I, I want a name when I lose, they call Alabama the Crimson Tide,

Call me Deacon Blues.

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John Galt's avatar

I do that too, it's the fun part, and I've done it on a lot of instruments that I can play something on, but not well. Going through the pain of learning theory. It's a dirty job but it has to be done.

And they sound so cool don't they? I think this is the most healing instrument I've had my hands on. And it was fucking expensive.

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Erik van Mechelen's avatar

built the 'roads' the right way

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Roxy Ballard's avatar

👌

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WC's avatar

I enjoyed starting with the PDF but then ordered a couple copies of the book from the Word Foundation. Very nice.

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NanookoftheNorthwest's avatar

Like many here the slog is real! I’m 75% in and I had to take a break as my mind was fried! I keep going back to several chapters and re-reading them. Ouch

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Voice Of The Doer's avatar

Try this companion guide: https://voiceofthedoer.gumroad.com/l/jjiloo I built this to help me with this content. It's free and might help you too?

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Patricia Lombardi's avatar

Thank you Paddy I think you are in one of my discord groups as well as here! Great 👍🏻 comment!

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Peter Michaels's avatar

What's Irish and sets out in the rain?

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Mikey's avatar

Who is to say its real though?

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Gizapowerplant's avatar

Fantastic CLIF, thank again for your time it's greatly appreciated! May your new beginnings be blessed!

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Patricia Lombardi's avatar

Yes same sentiment here! Love our Clif!

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Noelle Rilleau's avatar

No prebirth memories but definitely being a young baby, held by one adult with other adults in the room, and thinking very clearly " These adults are not qualified to take care of me ".

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John's avatar

That one hit home for me... It would seem that our larger selves are far more courageous than what ever was left for the incarnation.

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Cathy's avatar

Clif -Appreciate you a whole bunch. Good luck with all the moving, stay safe, be well!

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James hillier's avatar

🎯🙏💖

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Santo Cav's avatar

Many years ago, I transferred Thinking and Destiny to a more readable version in a Wiki on the internet.

http://destiny.wikidot.com/

Any queries email me at santocav@gmail.com

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Alex Routt's avatar

Thank you

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Simon's avatar

omg thank you so much for your work. This is great !

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Jeanette Emery's avatar

I am a female, and very early memories. I also know that I entered the body just prior to birth. Further, I have early memories which occurred well before my infant body became "active" as you say. Preconceived and/or fixed notions about how things are will cause one's perspective to get stuck.

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Clare Munday's avatar

Thanks , I also have pre birth memories and very clear one and I am female ….

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Heidi Vandenberg's avatar

Read my message Hahahhahah

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Morpheus's avatar

I can't find the message....No posts on your Substack....But today's message from Clif is one of my all-time favorites and a fitting gift before an extended break. So if Clif blames you for this, I thank you!

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valerie doyle's avatar

I have no pre-birth memories, however after giving birth to my first child, I can recall a “click” sound which came from above my head and over to the right about a foot. I recall looking over, didn’t see anything but recall hearing a voice say “oh look, I back”. I always assumed that the voice was mine and I must have “gone somewhere “ during the painful birth process, even though I did not recall any out of body experience. Years later now, I am thinking that perhaps it wasn’t my voice but the voice of my daughter, which would make more sense as she had just arrived. My recollection of the event was that the voice sounded somewhat surprised to be “back”.

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Ame Deneks's avatar

Fascinating! I’ve also wondered if that’s why most babies come out crying. Not this again! 😭

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Suzirhae's avatar

Oh, you just said a mouthful!! Cheers!

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Starmonkey's avatar

Suckered back in by the old honey pot...

🍯 🐝 🐝 🐝

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Jo G's avatar

There's no fool like an old fool

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Jacqueline J. Jarvis's avatar

lots of young fools now

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Paula G's avatar

I agree with choosing your parents & life but as a woman and a mother l don't agree with the soul entering after your birth.

When both my children were conceived l saw & felt a white light flash/ spark. I have been married 20 yrs and this has only happened twice during intimacy and it was the conception times.

I feel and agree with you Clif on most topics but this is my experience as vessel that protects & nurtures another souls growth.

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Brenda Purcell's avatar

I think Edgar Cayce also said that we can come in and out of our infant body since conception but sometimes maybe not completely 'settling in' until few months old? Also Jane Roberts (Seth) wrote in her Oversoul Seven trilogy of getting born again and gradually losing memory of previous lives and in between lives by kind of being saturated with sensual experiences like eating jam on her bread and gradually getting grounded in the new body

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Lori Long's avatar

Edgar Cayce was a true gem. Do you attend the Society's free seminars? Monthly Spiritual history lessons.

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Marten's avatar

Dolores Cannon attended the ARE 2 times !!!

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Brenda Purcell's avatar

No I was steeped in Edgar Cayce back in the day and read everything in print at the time - he was a great help

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AJnz's avatar

Its really important to openly share your perspective of this journey, so that others too may do so. No judgement, just sharing that we all can lift up and walk our unique paths, judging neither ourselves, or others. :)

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Duncan Phelps's avatar

I feel/have experienced that "our entrance Time" varies from entity to entity due to our TimeLevel.

Same with our options or "choice!"

https://rumble.com/user/duncanPhelps

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Paula G's avatar

Totally agree. l was just sharing from my experience.

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Aeth's avatar

as a father who could only experience it from the outside, I will say that the personalities of my children in the womb match how they came out :)

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Ann's avatar

When your moms egg and your dads sperm came together there was a spark of life. You are that light. You are a human. Hue-man(ifesting) hue manifesting. We are light.

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Linda Espinoza's avatar

I am soooo forking over this nasty chemtrail haze!!!

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Lisa's avatar

This sounds like the "place" that many trans-channels describe when they 'leave' their bodies so an enlightened Being can come in and share through them. Sometimes I wonder if it is where the primary personality 'goes' when a person with MPD goes but without the knowledge of the "other door". My dad used to build bunny houses for me as a child and there had to be two openings or the bunny wouldn't go in.

I was always taught that we choose our parents. We pick them, in any case, because they will provide the experiences we need to complete the next 'facet' of ourselves so that we can express the light most optimally. I studied at the Gemological Institute and found that diamonds are such a beautiful, real way of explaining many things in life. The pyramids, for example, are a reflection of the way most diamonds grow, naturally. The pyramids mirror themselves below the ground in shape and are created to express energy much like a perfectly cut diamond expresses light. There is a specific, mathematical way to cut any individual diamond based on everything about it to optimally express itself, reflecting, refracting and dispersing the most light.

Good to see you in this place, Clif. Your 'lovelight' is shining so bright. You are appreciated.

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Starmonkey's avatar

They've upped the game. Straight up bombing runs.

Must be close...

Howdy, woo whos.

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Hidetoshi Mori's avatar

Yes, you needed to teach many things! I learned a lot from you. Thank you for coming back to this world.

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Katie Stewart's avatar

Thank you Heidi for inspiring Clif. These are things I have always known. Glad to see there are others with the same experience.

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Rugnarldo's avatar

We love you too Clif. Thankyou for the light you share.

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