360 Comments
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BEFisher525's avatar

Why would ANYone for any reason be unkind to Heidi??!!!

They would be waving the Fucktard flag, no?

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MotoThinker's avatar

Lot of Fucktards coming out of the woodwork as of late.

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Resolute Red's avatar

Like rats out of a sinking ship.

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John Galt's avatar

They have a flag?

That's nice, they don't have much else going for them.

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Richard's avatar

I have a few designs in mind - probably not suitable for polite conversation

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Thunderhoof's avatar

I'll second that

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DrKimShallcross's avatar

Jealous people

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Carolyn Halfkenny's avatar

This post earned a follow…..

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BEFisher525's avatar

What a blessing - clif's voice to soothe a migraine!

Thank you sensei.

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goldensnakegoddess@verizon.net's avatar

Press, with all 4 fingers on the lateral sides of both BIG TOES.. ie. on the left side of the Left Big Toe, and on the right side of the Right Big Toe; that is the migraine /headache reflex area. If you cross your hands at the wrists and grab the left toe with the right hand, and the right toe with the left hand, your four-fingers can more easily grab the inside of those toes. IF IT HURTS, PRESS HARDER. ;-) OR you can lay your thumb down firmly. HOLD for a few or more minutes. That pressure will travel up from those nerve endings back up to the head. Pressing the space below and between the thumb nail & above the distal-phalange joint could also relieve reduce pain. That spot is the nasal sinus reflex point; pressing on the tip of the toe (above-beyond the thumb nail) are the reflex points for the upper nasal cavities in the forehead -- in case you suffer from sinus headaches too.

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Roby Bravender's avatar

Thank you for sharing this with us. Namaste!

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John Galt's avatar

If you're serious about the migraine, I read a while ago that chlorine dioxide is a means to handle those. Never had one myself but I've witnessed the suffering.

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BEFisher525's avatar

Maybe - this one is vertebrae C2 - healing from multiple MVAs and a few falls from pruning trees . . =:-\\ thanks.

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DK's avatar

MIGRALEVE™ used to be my medication until I found out I had a reaction to tea & gave it up.

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Apr 3Edited
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John Galt's avatar

Oh look, more spam!

It's not the wonderful kind though.

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Alexander Fell's avatar

Also Take a look at microdosing shrooms and taking Glycine

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BEFisher525's avatar

Daily (glycine, and "shrooms" Chaga, Reishi et al =:-]]]

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Garito's avatar

The think that helped me the most (mine weren't as hard as other friends I have): meditation. But not when the migraine is at full steam but as a prevention

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Heidi Vandenberg's avatar

Oh the end 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣thanks Clif

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Miri's avatar

Heidi, I love the effect you have on Clif - his voice has gotten softer, like you've taken the 'grumpy' out of the 'old' man (excuse me Clif, no offense, I'm heading towards old myself ;)), listening to him now is even more fun.

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Heidi Vandenberg's avatar

He still can be grumpy 🤣 but so can I … it works well ❤️

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James hillier's avatar

Hey Heidi, love from the Mtns of Ireland. Just to say us old guys who have studied the machinations that the Ontology offers us, (Ontology - God & the Spiritual Heirachy, the very Being of all beings ... Read God Speaks, 1956 - Avatar Meher Baba), as necesary life lessons can surely get a bit grumpy and really need the love, affection and comforting of a dear soul. I can't say enough about this gift of a true freind in ones life. We tend to get so wrapped up in the show that we can forget what really matters...

I also am of 6 King, VI.King descent and one of the most privileged people I have ever known for so many reasons. As you must know your relationship with dear Clif is no mistake, orchestrated by the Mental Sphere, aka Angelics, in line with karmic connection, and it warms my heart to hear the gentleness in his voice as others have mentioned.

I remember watching him build his tri-miran boat before he ever showed his face for the reason he gave that his parents were still incarnate. If you both are ever in Ireland our doors are open to you both, you can stay in our little peice of paradise here as long as you wish cuddling our furry faces friends and arranging flowers.

Do look into Meher Baba, the Ancient One, if that feeling arises, He is not for everyone at this time as this is still within the Avartic period but I feel to mention Him as Clif would gain so much understanding of karma just turning a few pages of God Speaks, he has basically got it nailed anyway so that book would simply open new vistas.

One last thing I feel to say is that Baba stated that the path of the adept/lover, of God is a singular path that eventually overcomes all desires but as this is not possible for most so then the next path is companionship but stay with them. After challenge after challenge to victory after victory all it takes is a glance or touch from the Perfect Master to achieve an everlasting abode with The Beloved, (paraphrased). I feel you both have this as a work in progress, and do my wife and I. Don't worry, Be Happy, (coined by Baba long before the song that was inspired by Baba lovers, friends of Bobby Mc Ferran), for me it is important to do this in everyday life and then something else can happen.

Hugs for you both x

jameshillier@yahoo.co.uk

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Heidi Vandenberg's avatar

I may send you my Viking relations and maybe you can take a look there’s 13 of them lol

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James hillier's avatar

That's sweet of you but I'm no expert, It'll be interested all the same. I do know my family came over from Gaul 1k years ago, Norman's are settled Vikings, it's an interesting story. I'm a 6'6" redhead that according to Tristram, my celebrated artist grandfather (look him up) I look like a pre-Raphelite. 😅

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James hillier's avatar

btw, don't worry, Karmic debt is accrued depending on intent, a severe example is the hangman that performs his/her duties to serve the state and put food on the table, they will take on light sanskaras, (imprints of experience), as does one that posts material for the best possible reasons despite others interpretations or influences that might lead them down a path like, say, suicide. Your intent is pure, that's the only language that is heard, the language of the heart! Baba was very clear that only direct living experience, (not dreams or a disincarnate state between lives), or Divine Grace can eradicate karma and that deep rooted red sanskaras, like sexual promiscuity, murder, rape etc are very difficult to remove, "The repocussions of sexual promiscuity are horrific." This is I imagine referring mostly to war situations in which so many imprints are released thereby liberating a soul from past actions. He also stated in His silence that He would not get rid of our karma but He might lower it from our head to our shoulders...

I hope this is somewhat of a clarification. xxx for you both 💫🙏💖

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Miri's avatar

I guess that's his charme 😉

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Tim Lynch's avatar

🌿 Yes, as we get into our 70's, we realise that our time around the sun, a living consciousness that broadcasts, light (colour) Radio waves, microwaves, infrared, ultraviolet, X-rays, and gamma rays. Plus neutrinos - solar wind etc - is 'speaking' to us - and if we are conscious we become more conscious. So Bro Clif is not a kid-cowboy anymore, - me too - and because of becoming more aware and 'knowing' we soften more because we want to lighten up the universe and assist more souls especially youth breaking out of their cosmic egg - to burst into the light. So good on you Clif. Yes, I notice the timbre of your voice has changed. Good on you M8.🔥

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Katie Foxxx's avatar

Heidi!!!! So happy to have heard Cliff's dispatch today! The more Cliff talks about you, the more I'm seeing WHY the universe brought you together....it's actually a rejoining methinks...: "I'm a pirate by nature"... "Heidi is (sp?) Scythian and of Nordic pirates...". I LOVE IT!! <3 I too have uncovered something long suspected in my paternal heritage and I've had this feeling the past couple of days that Clif refers to. Almost like unusually strong mounting tension. I'm thinkinng there's ALSO a good reason WE were brought together under unusual circumstances! ;) I'd REALLY like to have a vedic reading with you Heidi. I wouldn't consider anyone else. Please direct me to thhe best channnel to book that if possible. <3 Clif's description of how you mitigated the upcoming/now present heaviness and how both of you, sharing what the ontology is speaking to you and making sense of it, explains WHY together, you are so powerful. It makes the insights Clif provides that much more, well, INSIGHTFUL!! :) It also warmed my heart to hear confirmation of what I already sensed, that you are so good at what you do BECAUSE of your depth of compassion, understanding, and being tapped into the live feed, so to speak. With power comes great responsibility, right? And Clif's words on karma hit as well. Yesterday I explained to the girl why I left another stunning Cottswald bud vase behind, even though in mint condition and together, far more resaleable. "If someone had done that before I arrived, I wouldn't have this little thing of beauty to look upon. Who am I to rob the next person of that pleasure?" MAN, did his work ever resonate today. Much love to you both!!

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Heidi Vandenberg's avatar

Right now I don’t do readings for the public . When this changes I will let you know .

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Hollis Mongeon's avatar

Ive been following clif for years now and i am definitely interested in Ayurvedic astrology now . Never had a reading etc , im afraid of it for some reason . But im interested in you now ! You two are a breath of fresh air in such a troubling world right now ! I see you getting very successful in the future of guiding this crazy world we are in . ❤️

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BEFisher525's avatar

Is there a waiting list? =;-]]

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Heidi Vandenberg's avatar

I know who has been nice 🙂I never forget . Can be moved to the top of the list lol

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T Bondurant's avatar

Oooh I would love to be on that list and finally hear you explain my birth chart...that would be very cool! 🌹

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Marjorie's avatar

Do you have a non-X link for some information from you directly? Substack? Telegram?

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Heidi Vandenberg's avatar

I have a YouTube channel but 1 troll pissed me off and I have not made another video since 🙂right now I’m not posting videos or anything like that .

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Debreena's avatar

I found laughing at trolls and other creatures entertaining. Sometimes I answer with laughter telling them they got the umtard award that day with more laughter. Their comment can be deleted and you can block them too. I do the same at stores. I smile at those who look like they drink liquids with alum added. If they do not smile back, usually my senses are right about them, one of the parasites. Most humans give at least a small smile back, even if they are having a bad day. The best thing about laughing and/or smiling (if in person) one of the parasites, it ruins their day. (big ornery smile)

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T Bondurant's avatar

Pls do let us know when you do

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Marjorie's avatar

You don't contribute to FFG? Is there a show you have appeared on?

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Alexander Fell's avatar

Viking huh ;)

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John Galt's avatar

Sounds Dutch to me. I know some of those.

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Suzirhae's avatar

May I ask, what state do you do realtor in? I may be moving to Idaho and need some advice. Thanks 😊

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Heidi Vandenberg's avatar

I sell new homes, for a national builder . If you see a new community and they have a model home, I’m the one who does the selling . I’m also on the East coast .

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Suzirhae's avatar

Are you talking about modular homes, like a double wide? We lived in one about 13 years ago and I loved it.

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Heidi Vandenberg's avatar

Communities with amenities and HoAs, we stick build

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Suzirhae's avatar

My hubby is a concrete superintendent and he is looking at doing tilt wall building. He does both residential and commercial projects, but he prefers the big commercial building.

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Heidi Vandenberg's avatar

No … like this Some of the leading national new home builders in the U.S. include D.R. Horton, Lennar, PulteGroup, Toll Brothers, NVR, Taylor Morrison, KB Home, and Meritage Homes

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Suzirhae's avatar

Thank you.

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Starmonkey's avatar

PO-TAY-TOES. Taters.

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Pat McNair's avatar

Or if your in OZ ....Spuds

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denbo's avatar

every Ying must have a Yang - it warms my heart to see you two become one - I can hear it in my brother from another mother's voice!

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Lynn Quinn's avatar

There will never be a shortage of jealous people who attack young, beautiful, energetic ladies who speak out with skill and who are loved by powerful information stud muffins.

Further, I just realized, after listening to this, that Heidi High does, indeed, sound like a powerful pirate queen name, so no wonder she’s getting fear reactions. LOL. 😎🗡️🏴‍☠️⚓️

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Paddy O'Furniture's avatar

Gotta leave this here again, Heidi High indeed. Heidi heidi heidi high heidi heidi heidi ho, yo ho ho and a bottle of rum for these two pirates.

https://youtu.be/spBLdH5mtyk

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Lynn Quinn's avatar

Good one, truth lives inside the music✨

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John Galt's avatar

ROFL!

Nice one centurion.

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Thunderhoof's avatar

We missed the wedding? Clif?

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Cathe's avatar

I am so sorry to hear about Heidi being attacked by trolls. People doing something like that never entered my mind. I still find it hard to imagine that this has occurred ......but that is because I am basically a hermit and have never been in the public eye. I guess it pays sometimes to be a super private nobody.

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Heidi Vandenberg's avatar

I am a hermit once I leave the corporate world I will be even more of a hermit 🙂

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John Galt's avatar

I left the corporate world seven years ago having no idea how wonderful that would be. It is.

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Thunderhoof's avatar

Lot's of psychopaths in Corp upper mgmt. I also left big corp matrix 7 yrs ago. Horrible culture, especially when these people fuck with you.

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John Galt's avatar

I was generally a founder, so not subject to that crap but I always said if your CEO isn't an asshole you need a new one.

You don't have to like them. They don't need to be assholes within the company either, another reason to need a new one.

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Resolute Red's avatar

I have a strong intuition that the more we Ascend the more the Reptilians descend. They’re on the verge of violent madness.

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MotoThinker's avatar

The Corporate world, the most wretched Hive of scum and villainy.

May you be able to exit it amicably, sooner rather than later.

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Heidi Vandenberg's avatar

I have financial goals lol but I’m well aware :-)

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T Bondurant's avatar

My relocation astrologer guided me where to escape to here in beautiful bountiful Wisconsin. Situated also on the only stable small land plate in America and one of the oldest bedrock in the world, unshaken. 😊

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Maria's avatar

You mean mean still untouched and spoiled?

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T Bondurant's avatar

Yes☺️

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T Bondurant's avatar

I could tell ya some stories about how bush Goldman Sachs JPM Chase took down Washington mutual bank, largest mortgage lender in US at the time which brought on the crash 2008. When I worked few floors in the Seattle "tower" below the President/CEO. I was a AVP at the time in mortgage lending and technical writing for the company guidelines manuals etc etc. These disturbing men in black wool coats to their knees in the elevator with going up to see the Prez...talking to me about the power of 11:11 means "power". Really strange we suddenly crashed within days. Shocking!

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Thunderhoof's avatar

I'm so sorry you chose mtge loan business to survive the matrix. Pacific First Mtge in Seattle bought out Transamerica Mtge wgen I worked there in the late 80s 90s? 40 yrs in it I swam that swamp. Corp criminal psychopaths. 20 yrs had my own small firm

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T Bondurant's avatar

Then I escaped a Goldman Sachs subpoena to testify in state supreme Court on the crash case. What a trip!

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Thunderhoof's avatar

My processor knew Washington Mutual founder/owner. She knew the dirt but I think was afraid to say anything. Some shit was going on with that whole takeover.

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T Bondurant's avatar

Same here...felt the same way in corporate mortgage financing and RE sales caree in Fla and WA states. . Retired now pretty much and raising my gramdbabies on a lovely rural Wisconsin lake lot acreage. So I can respect being a hermit type after all. ☺️❤️

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Maria's avatar

Yes leave that stinking world...digging up more woods, empty land to build is not a good business. The job may be good for the individual, the developers, realtors, but not for the natural world and it's beauty. I hate realtors work...

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John Galt's avatar

A hermit is what I aspire to be. Working on it.

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Sy's avatar

Why not?!

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John Galt's avatar

I have wilderness, but I have to make it more comfortable if I'm going to spend winters there.

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Sy's avatar
Apr 3Edited

I like one of Mark Twain's (Samuel L. Clemens) sayings: "The more I know people, the more I love my dog." There's a huge difference between being alone and being lonely. I'm frequently alone, but seldom to never do I ever feel lonely. Also, as Mack Davis said, in one of his lines in his famous song, "Oh Lord it's hard to be humble," ..."I never get lonesome 'Cause I treasure my own company." In any case solitude can, if you want it to be, serenity! Blessings in all you do.

I'd like to add, while it might sound as if I'm something of a misanthrope, that is NOT AT ALL the case. I just prefer to choose my friends more carefully than some others might.

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WhitePillAnon's avatar

Another fellow hermit who enjoys his aloneness! Chapeau!

Always an introvert, I’ve spent the last 15 years fully retreating into my private world. Being alone—al-one, all-one—is worlds apart from feeling lonely. The first is at peace with oneself; the latter aches for others.

German etymology nails it: Allein (all-ein, all-eins, all-one); Einsam (ein-sam, ein-Same, one-seed, a solitary seed).

Or, as the Indian mystic Osho puts it:

Aloneness is you within God; loneliness is you without God.

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Sy's avatar

Amen!

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Thunderhoof's avatar

Well said. I can relate. Me myself and I get together often.

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Stephanie B's This and That's avatar

Perhaps you are telepathically connected with Heidi.

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KarmaDoc's avatar

Karma is a force to be reckoned with, I agree. ;)

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John Galt's avatar

Neighbour is a Buddhist. He said that other day, "I don't believe in luck." I said "What about karma?" Got two thumbs up.

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Redpill🔥🇮🇱🔥's avatar

Ohhhhh boi is it EVER!😑

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Thunderhoof's avatar

Redpill, so close to greatness this morning had to settle for 2nd comment bags of silver having the razor sharp wit and skill of squeezing in two 2nd place comments. Nice zpt move Redpill. 💰 💰

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Thunderhoof's avatar

🏆 🏆 🏆 Doctor of Karma 🏆 🏆 🏆 and so fitting - has left the ER room just in time to garnish the coveted 1st comment award because of the karmic brilliance exuded from clean living.

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Rory Siegel's avatar

I've listened to your podcast for quite a long time and have been dismayed in recent months at some of your comments. Just my opinion which I'm sure you'll discount but your judgmentalness about certain things in my mind tends to undermine your credibility. To lump all channelers into the same boat is not accurate nor wise. I do agree that many people that think they're channeling are basically channeling aspects of their own personality but that is not true of all of them. Nor is it true that the material some bring through is not a value because it often goes far beyond your description of spiritual pablum. As usual discernment is the key. Nor is describing it or those listening to it as a mental illness appropriate or accurate as every human being finds valuable information from a variety of sources. Just because you have not had that experience does not mean that those that have are mentally unbalanced.

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T Bondurant's avatar

Sometimes I think I'mentally I'll. 😳

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Thunderhoof's avatar

The mortgage business will do that to you

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Lulu France's avatar

Serious question?

If you spoke to The Bug? What's the difference to others speaking to alternative universe 'inhabitants'?

And I sincerely hope Heidi is 'handling' you. And I mean that in the nicest way possible to both of you 😘

F**k all the naysayers.

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clif high's avatar

channels are batshit crazy due to their own minds. When i 'spoke' with the Bug, i was on massive amounts of psilocybin. If channels took real shamanic levels of drugs, 1) i would have more respect for them; 2) their spew would be really connected to something outside themselves by the nature of the drug.

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Mo's avatar

Mr. High. You opened this video with the statement "Universe guides. That is the subject of this video. Universe guiding us." You then continue to explain your evaluation of the unfolding events within your event stream and according to your ontological belief system take these events as guidance. Then you act on this guidance and make a video that you present to the world. My friend you are a channeler. And I don't think you are batshit crazy.

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Thunderhoof's avatar

Here's a definition of singularity.

: a point or region of infinite mass density at which space and time are infinitely distorted by gravitational forces and which is held to be the final state of matter falling into a black hole.

Blew my mind seeing this via Websters.

Semitic- a lot like semantic definition. Words origins and meanings are very facinating.

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T Bondurant's avatar

Agreed

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Heidi Vandenberg's avatar

lol

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Thunderhoof's avatar

Seriously?

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Cathy's avatar

Clif- just love you! Be safe and give Heidi my best!

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Redpill🔥🇮🇱🔥's avatar

Thank's Clif brother!❤️🙏👍👍

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Sadie Wiggles's avatar

I love when men stand up to protect women and are public about it.

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Elise's avatar

100%

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Shellie's avatar

Same reason there’s no use going for a psychic reading because you can change the course of your karma as soon as you walk out the door with your choices

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Thunderhoof's avatar

Choices. The most powerful qualia in our ontology

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JB Slear's avatar

Thanks 4 the update and remember never trust a muslim

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BEFisher525's avatar

But trust a jew is ok?

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Sy's avatar
Apr 3Edited

Not if you value your life! ...just kidding. Some Jewish people are very ethical and would never intentionally want to do anyone any harm. However, I would say without any reservation, NEVER TRUST any Zionist. Why? Because Zionism = Satanism!

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John Galt's avatar

I believe that's the implication.

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BEFisher525's avatar

>:p

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Thunderhoof's avatar

Or a Pharisee

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Katie Foxxx's avatar

Please be gone, offensive rebrobate. You don't belong in this space of higher minds.

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John Galt's avatar

That mantra is getting tiresome.

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BEFisher525's avatar

but, but, but . . . I HAVE to respond every time JB posts that! =:-]]]

(My daughter married into a lovely muslim family; we have been to many mosques and know many fine wonderful Islam folks. Very peaceful, very kind and literally give you the shirt (or scarf) off their bodies!

Some muslim scholars on YT and podcasts are superb human beings. Very unlike the Khazarian evil ones or the "muslim" brotherhood folks who terrorize and bring bad to the good ones - kind of like the weirdo "Christians" do as well.

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John Galt's avatar

Yes, there are many in the middle east pissed off at having the shit bombed out of civilians by the US. Who can blame them.

The Palestinians welcomed the Jews with open arms before the Nakba.

Left to their own devices they are as you describe.

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JB Slear's avatar

I feel sorry for your family islam is a very aggressive and one sided religion good luck trying to leave islam alive

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Guido's avatar

" weirdo "Christians" do as well" Would that be the Baptist snake charmer types, .... or the Catholics ?? hahaha

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Sy's avatar

I agree. Mostly due to the almost totally Jew controlled media, Muslims have been painted with a, 'broad stroke of the brush,' so to speak, as bad or evil people! I do not believe that any more than you apparently do. This IS NOT to say that I advocate or support their religion, because I don't. Neither do I support in any way shape or form Judaism, for the exact same reason. That is to say that said both religions are of the Evil One! Never the less, some people, no matter what their 'religion,' seem to be intrinsically good and generally speaking, nice people!

I'm sorry to have to agree with you that some so-called Christians are also despicable and unworthy of the label.

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T Bondurant's avatar

I'm confused...what did I miss?☺️

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Sy's avatar
Apr 3Edited

Let's be realistic here! There are good and bad in every national, ethnic and/or religious group. Most Muslims get an exceptionally undeserved bad reputation PRIMARILY because the Jewish controlled media wants as many people as possible to join them in their Satanic war not just against Muslims. And they, the Zionists, SPEND LOADS of Media money to make them look much worse than they actually are. What Must be remembered is that these Zionists want everyone else who isn't, 'on their Zionist team,' DEAD. 1st Thessalonians, Chapter 2, verses 14 through 15 tells it all... that states (paraphrased), 'They (the Jews) have made themselves the enemies of all humanity.' That scripture was aimed at the Scribes and Pharisees of Jesus's earthly visitation in the physical. Now, I'd like to be VERY clear here, I want nothing to do with either Judaism or Islam as far as their belief systems go, because I'm convinced that both are FALSE religions, and I surely advocate NEITHER. But, I will always give people the benefit of the doubt so long as I don't have to put my life on the line via placing naive trust in anyone. That would be foolish. Just keep this in mind, Trust is earned, NEVER given.

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T Bondurant's avatar

Agreed there are good and bad everywhere

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Ellen Sovereign's avatar

I don't know Heidi. However, her beautiful energy is relayed through Clif. I don't know him either but that's how it works.

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Margaret Treis's avatar

Clif, we live in a conscious ocean of "action" which is what karma is, as of course you know. That ocean isn't independent of consciousness. Universe is as conscious as we are, actually infinitely more so since we're typically limited by ego, the "I" we believe ourselves to be. But none of our separation BELIEF can cancel our actual existence AS the whole... or our receiving information from the whole. I believe Universe, Creator, Ontology, or whatever you want to call this vast consciousness, is actually at pains to communicate with us and does so continuously. I don't see why concepts coming from consciousness, called "channeling," are any different from watching what's happening in what only appears to be external to us. There's interpretation involved in both cases that could be wrong. The Universe speaks to us in as many ways as we are tuning into. The question of fraud in channeling is a completely different issue and I don't exclude it, but I've found much that is profound in a number of works that have been channeled and I see no reason to think it's always solely somebody's mental backtalk. After all, what is your mind if not part of Universe? You appear to validate/approve of/ put confidence in a form of taking information from Universe called remote viewing. What's different with that? What keeps mental back talk out of that? Or out of what you see happening in your own event stream? I think that any time we are involved with Universe, and that's 24/7, we are taking in information from it, regardless of what the information is called, and one form is no different from another. What we interpret it to mean is the layer where we can misunderstand or miss the point entirely. It's interpretation where mental backtalk can enter and that's no different in any form of trying to understand what Universe is saying. Channeling isn't the bullshit you say, any more than any other interpretation of information from Universe, and it's no more susceptible than any of the others to backtalk.

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James hillier's avatar

It may interest you to hear that Meher Baba did state that, “A true gift is when giver and receiver forget, no feeling of being obliged or obligation, completely forgotten.” and, “God’s apparent callousness towards His Creation is in the nature of a true gift.”

To me this means that after the initial creation of individualised consciousness out of The Ocean, the ‘drop soul’ like a bubble on the surface, if there could be a surface, feeling itself separate from the Ocean but made of the same ‘stuff’, after that point on it’s journey through form in the evolution then involution of consciousness the One The First Soul, The Ancient One, The Creator Being of all beings basically leaves this process to the immutable Law of Karma to exhaust all experience, certainly through the first six of the seven Kingdoms of life. It is only when the individual longs to know and has lived out the myriad of lives that facilitate this that The Beloved can then begin ‘dancing’ with that individual. In other words it is only when the individual takes a step that He can then step towards that pilgrim in a personalised way. Is this what the Ontology irreligious? I can’t say. Religion is only a conduit and its rituals likened to the husk of a seed. It is only the seeds germ, tge love, the language of the heart that He hears, so we’re told. True worship has nothing to do with blind faith or delusion, on the contrary it is simply the love that the pilgrim feels for the Beloved and longs to gain union with that, however he finds it. It is a mistake to paint with a wide brush, many who are religious or channeling and such are in cloud cuckoo land and often are victims of their self created delusions but there are always exceptions who are genuine.

The Karmic path cannot be completely understood fully until one discovers the driving force behind it. Neti- Neti is a way to see it and it’s true but the accumulated imprints of previous experience, Sanskaras, and the psychic energy delegated to all action is key to finding out what drives and sustains the journey from form to form.

I’ve mentioned many times and probably to often the dictated work of Babas called God Speaks, published by Dodd-Mead in 1956. If I were on a desert island and had the choice of two books it would be this and The Discources by a very long shot!

I hope this is of some assistance seen from my insects perspective.

☘ Mtn blessings and hugs xxx

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Margaret Treis's avatar

Hugs back. I have some different views and some that are the same as yours, as would be expected. The wording may be different if not the general idea. We ALL evaluate information based on our own sense of validity. And that works pretty well because we're always looking from our point zero in the now, and we start from there. It's a mistake to think it's anything other than subjective. However, there is a truth behind it all, no matter what we make of existence in any moment, because that truth doesn't exist in time, and in my view, constitutes a loving, creative Presence. To me, we currently live in a world of our own ideas that has little to do with creation because it's based on an impossible idea we want to live out...that of separation from the whole. So, we've got our own tempest in a teapot made of our own ideas. One of our own making, not the Creator's. There's another point that's interesting. A brilliant outlier physicist, Nassim Haramein, has worked out a very different unified field theory where there was no one point of creation. Rather, he postulates with his mathematics, very unlike Einstein's, that creation is ongoing, happens in every moment, in fact billions of times a second, and there is a feedback loop between the created and the larger creation. This loop feeds information from conscious creation back to a conscious field of potential. The field then produces a manifestation that fits. I hope I'm stating this properly, but it's the gist. In my view, this is a sacred process, BECAUSE it has profound meaning and feeling. Its intent is freedom of experience, although we bind ourselves all the time to our own wrong ideas. I mentioned love. Love in this sense is the binding factor and constitutes regard, respect, and the recognition that everything that exists is in fact one existence. It's profound belonging. There's nothing indifferent about it. We're given free reign to create our own tempest if that's what we want. If we want to define the consciousness of creation as indifferent, cold, even calculating, that will be the way we experience it in a perception of it we have limited. The whole communicates wholeness constantly, but we can set ourselves outside it in our own heads. There are no limits on the communication. It comes as intuition, as ideas different from our own separation theories, true vision, physical signs and synchronicity, it can be literally words. Stuff like remote viewing are intrinsic to the self, as is receiving messages called channeling and the feeling of intimacy with Creation. That's a lot to push aside in order to have the limited world of a mechanistic Universe referred to as indifferent. The way it's pushed aside is to say it doesn't exist and, further, that whoever thinks it exists is an idiot. That will seem obvious to the person who's pushed it out of experience. There will be a, maybe unconscious, reason for doing this in the psyche of the individual. The reason will inevitably be based on the illusion of separation. But I don't choose that path.

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James hillier's avatar

I must of course add as a footnote of some importance the relevance of the book God Speaks. I repeat this again and again not to coerse, love needs no coersion, but to point out the mine of nuggets of wisdom it contains. Anyone who has at least turned a few pages of it must realize its significance. In fact Don Stevens (a very dear Beloved who made many videos and was very high up in standard oil), stated that Baba had told him there was something like an atom bomb of potency to every word so that even if one doesn't understand any of it there is some sort of initiation. (paraphrased). Baba did state that if one loves any other form of the God incarnate man, the God-Man, then focus on the root core of love given at that time, that's always given, and forget about Meher Baba. This might be what was alluded to in the 'germ of the seed' statement.

Thank you for this opportunity Margaret and I hope Clif reads our conversation but perhaps this is not the life where he relizes these realities. For everything there is a season. . . Why me at this time? I'm not sure but Don told me I was a Mast in my previous life and that Baba had told Don after Don blurted out how crazy they were, " Yes, their minds are broken and I will not perform the miracle of mending them but I will break the spell so in their next life they can have a normal lifetime." . . . and being a tradesmen my life is the epitome of normal 😅

Hugs xxx

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James hillier's avatar

Goodness, thank you for sharing. The tempest in the teapot bit is I investing and yes I see Creation having a certain amount of freewheeling but of course as the flower of life has shown us and as Nassim states the tetrahedron is within the Sphere. There is nothing beyond the Sphere so that as a metaphor for The Creator or The Avatar anything within the Sphere is His Game. Baba stated God is the very being of all beings and even went as far as saying something unbelievable. One day He came out of a cave where He'd been doing some of His work in seclusion, a common theme in His life. There was a crowd waiting for him and He stated with a huge smile, "I have met with the saints and sages of the inner planes and we have mapped out humanities future for the next 2,000 years." Then He looked at someone in the crowd quite seriously who maybe had doubt or something and pointed at them stating, "Yes, and I know what you will think in two million years!"

The Mind of God stands still, (no time)

- the mind of a Musti or Mast, (God intoxicated), is slowed down

- The mind of a man is walking

- The Mind of a madman is running.

. . . and then He stated, "Most people are mad."

The 22 (44) trillion times a second in and out of alternate phase, that is creation and destruction alternately, is a concept as old as time, certainly it's recorded in the tome of the Vedas and it was refreshing to see Clif mention it. Mahayogis know about slowing the mind. The Masts experience it because their minds are broken from intense longing and love for their Beloved and as a result can weild huge psychic energy which Baba stated Hd used for various purposes to give them an opportunity to become involved. The Yogis do it under strict guidelines so as not to loose their minds permanently. Something else happens when time slows down, there are reports that Sasquach do this to people sometimes but so many reports of epiphanies in consciousness in this state. We've all heard about car crashes where this is witnessed.

I know you are correct in that love is the key, ultimately a love we cannot easily fathom in this Gross Sphere. Again Baba was very clear about this but also advocated violence when absolutely required. 'Violence of the brave,' like a surgeon with a scalpel of one protecting mother or motherland... (listed in the Discources).

I see Clifs main setback being he hasn't been able to accept, understandably after the horrible conditioning some go through in childhood by those that deem to know about religion, or digest much of the information given to us by the Masters throughout history. They is a far cry from the invaders that take on deified personas for means of control and ego. What I'm talking about are the governors of Creation, those that influence minds and hearts, the voice of inspiration, creativity, intuition, what Baba calls the Mental Sphere - the real Angelics of which there are reportedly 770 million in Creation. These states of consciousness are a long way from corporeal machinations. Of course I see Rama, Krishna, Christ as all advents of the same Ancient One, the Vishnu aspect of Creation, come again and why not, it makes perfect sense when one has a foundation of understanding.

Thanks again. xxx

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Margaret Treis's avatar

Reading your posts, I get the psychedelic image in the back of my mind of Hindu gods endlessly repeating and retreating that we've all seen in Hindu art. (Not that you endlessly repeat, it's just an impression your words carry.) I've been there in meditations...where things have the fractal characteristics that we see in Indian art. I got the impression of things within things, like nested dolls, and certainly of all of it being one in the presence of love. I would agree that all the major teachers have risen from collective consciousness for the purpose of bringing truth to an illusion where we could easily become lost in our own creations, like a hall of mirrors. But even their teachings become warped over time into ego narratives characterized by fear. Christianity is a prime example. The warping there has been deplorable. What is faith-destroying for most humans is not being aware that all the chaos we experience doesn't come from "God," but from our own minds. That leads to the belief in an indifferent, maybe even cruel "Universe," "Ontology" or "God." A paranoid delusion. In some, it results in a pugilistic persona that comes from the fear and anger that necessarily invades such a life view.

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James hillier's avatar

Ohh my, I like that Margaret, thank you, a kaleidoscopic montage of Hindu deities dancing to and fro . . . I guess this could sort of describe my childhood experience of being introduced to Baba through Christ (who I despised because of the pain of the animals - that was later utterly reconciled), and the song candles in the rain by Melanie - the opening words, it was quite sublime while as a 10 year old playing chess with my older brother, the metaphors not lost on me, I asked so many Who He was but nobody knew... definitely later in life when He really started dancing with my consciousness, slowly at first, I got the Eastern fragrance through Krishna &Rama. Later I realized they're all the same Ancient One. My question as a child of being abandoned by Christ 2,000 years ago was again, completely reconciled. For the next 20 years I as a seeker went to and fro from tradition to tradition constantly coming back to Baba and getting my questions answered... that's an abiding quality He is well known for, utterly satisfying any queries.

Russian dolls is an analogy I haven't thought of but in a way it suits. We're told over countless millenia of time souls have matriculated from this schoolroom and each time, only a handful every age, they do it through love, (interestingly He did state that in the past many are called, few chosen and even fewer make it but in the near future many will be taken, I guess we matriculate en-masse?!). 😃💖

Those that would take to root core teaching of love given every time to control, exploit and smother humanity from its true nature have never managed to succeed for long. Despite the Yugas and the Galactic energy shift from age to age Baba gave us something more, an explanation that gives clues into the very fabric of the enlightenment journey.

Once a young man asked Baba, "You tell us of the value of virtue, selflessness, robbing yourself to help others and loving God and everyone, all those good things, to bring about union with The Beloved but surely in duality it is just as possible to reach that Reality through the left hand path also, to be as wicked as we can be?"

Baba replied, "Theoretically what you say is correct however I can tell you by my Divine Honesty that not once in Creation has this ever happened and the reason for this is that no soul could stand the pain." (paraphrased)

They destroy or change His words in a vain attempt to keep what they can never hold onto forever. Their wickedness creates so much pain karmically that they irresistibly are drawn to the right hand path and in that process exhaust at least a part of the necessary 'evil'. . . To exhaust all soul experience takes so many lives over such a long period of time but we are constantly refreshed after each life . . . that's another story.

Thank you for your sharing. For me this is cathartic but be assured there are no ulterior motives, I write because I feel to write - really I'm just a stupid person with blessings.

💫🙏💖

Hugs xxx

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Margaret Treis's avatar

Holy Sabbatai Zevi! If anything proves the left way's destruction it's him...and his disciples who are still trying to prove it leads to God as they wind their way through the most advanced forms of mayhem and depravity available in the egoic expression. I think all they found out in over 400 years, and arguably in spirit going back throughout history with the El, is that it never leads to anything really worthwhile or happiness making. Pleasure, maybe, but not happiness. Those two are badly confused. There's a lot of strife in it. And, at the worst, it demands the surrender of even humanity. The only way it can work to lead anywhere other than destruction is by sheer exhaustion and giving that plan up as a useless journey.

In a number of religions/legends around the world there is the idea of a coming resurrective new world, and an awakening/ascension/second coming/revelation scenario. I believe people at some level are aware of what's to come and they prophesy it in legends and religions. Avatars appear to keep it on the burner. What I think it all means is that at some level we are aware that this egoic dream ends and we become a more authentic whole self rather than separate personalities in perpetual states of war with each other at all sorts of levels, all the time grasping for something approaching love. But love isn't actually in the paradigm where relationships, from the personal to the geopolitical, are benefit transactions...."I give you this, you give me that in return. And you better or all hell is going to follow." Separation as a psychic identification doesn't work for a very simple reason. It's not true. It's very similar to the way gender identification is viewed in woke culture. One either is, or is not, a woman or a man. No amount of surgical intervention can change it. Being what we're not will never lead us back to what we are. And at the best we get from any of it is a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury signifying nothing. But, chin up. That there is so much expectation over history of an awakening from this dream means, if nothing else, the wave of manifestation will go that way eventually. Even Clif would warrant that since it's the whole basis of his predictive theories.

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